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tv   U.S. Senate  CSPAN  July 21, 2009 5:00pm-8:00pm EDT

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passed another sanctions resolution similar to the same resolution that north korea has brazenly violated to get to us this point. in 2006, the state department in its terrorism report said this about the north koreans on this list: they said -- quote -- "north korea continued to maintain ties to terrorist groups. most worrisome is that some of these countries, including north korea, also have the capability to manufacture weapons of mass destruction and other destabilizing technologies that can get into the hands of terrorists. if that was the justification for the terror list in 2006, certainly north korea's actions today fit that standard. perhaps even more so than back then. and i believe it is more so. now, we can't have it both ways. if we remove north korea have the terrorism list last year as a reward for its buboni its dubs
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cooperation on nuclear weapons, we would only add to that step after the regime betrayed its commitment and followed up hostile and provocative actions. i would like to address this issue. it has often been raised with me and the secretary of state has indirectly raised this with me, the multiple statute that control the list of state sponsor of terrorism do not allow the secretary of state to redes ire -- redesignate. i would like to read the relevant portions of each of these acts. they're saying, well, we've got to find factual basis that's different from the first round for us to do that. and we're going through a legal review of doing this. but here the state sponsored terrorism is controlled under three different acts, the arms export control act, the foreign assistance act -- these two acts. excuse me. these two acts that it's under.
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countries covered by the prohibition says this -- this is quoting from the arms export control act. the prohibition contained in this section apply with respect to a country if the secretary of state determines that the government of that country has repeatedly provided support for acts of international terrorism. now that's what it says in the arms export control act. the list i just read goes through what has taken place an they're clearly and repeatedly providing support for acts of international terrorism. tt doesn't say anything about they can't be relisted or we have to go through some elaborate finding process that it can't be based on actions that they've done. these are the actions they've done in the last six month that's are of public record. and it says that the secretary of state makes this determination. and has fairly wide discrepency to be able to do it. under the foreign assistance action, section 628 of the
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foreign assistance act says that the united states shall not provide any assistance to any country if the secretary of state determines that the government of that country has repeatedly provided support for acts of international terrorism. again, the statute is very broad in its statement. it doesn't say anything about they can't relist them. it says that they can do this on the discretion of the secretary of state. i don't know why we need to wait any longer. with the actions that this government has taken and even these most recent ones reported today of working with burma or of the publicly done ones that we know about of nuclear weapons detonation or the ones of missile technology being launched. why do we need to wait longer? mr. president, i recognize that this is a sense of the senate. so it is just a sense of this body. but this body has had a strong impact in prior actions when we
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took a sense of the senate resolution to list the revolutionary guard in iran that we believe that they should be listed as a state sponsor of terrorism. and the administration actcted t long after that to list them as a state sponsor of terrorism. i believe that this body took strong action here now and said we believe that north korea should be relisted as a state sponsor of terrorism, that it would send a very strong and proper signal to the administration, not that we are doing your job, but we believe that this is the case and that this is something that is meritorious toward north korea and its actions. that's why i would urge my colleagues to support the bipartisan bayh brownback amendment and vote for this amendment to the defense authorization bill. mr. president, with that, i yield the floor. read read mr. president? the presiding officer: the senator from rhode island. mr. reed: the chairman of the foreign relations committee, senator kerry, is prepared to comment and speak. i would ask unanimous consent at the conclusion of his remarks
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that the senator from delaware be recognized as if in morning business. the presiding officer: without objection. a senator: mr. president? the presiding officer: the senator from massachusetts. mr. kerry: mr. president, obviously north korea's actions in recent weeks, months really, testing a nuclear device on may 25th, and launching ballistic missiles on july 4th, received the appropriate objection in many different ways of china, japan, south korea, the united
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states, and many other countries. clearly those actions threaten to undermine the peace and security of north ease asia and -- east asia and the united states' response to those actionses ought to be and i believe is already resolute. china responded very clearly. the sanctions had been toughened, individual sanctions for the first time. a number of steps were taken by both the united nations and china. china, incidentally, unprecedented in some of -- personalize -- personally put in some of the sanctions that were put in place. i know that the senator from kansas cares enormously about the underlying issue here. but i have to say that this amendment is, while well intended, it simply doesn't do
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what it's supposed to do. it has no impact other than the sense of the senate sending a message, which at this particular moment i think, frankly, works counterproductively to other efforts that are under way. right now the secretary of state is meeting. right now the various countries involved in this delicate process are working to determine how to proceed to -- proceed forward with respect to getting back to talks and defusing these tensions. and for the united states senate just to pop on an amendment like this at this moment in time, not only sends a signal that complicates that process, but it also, frankly, will make it more difficult, i think, to secure the return of two american journalists, laura ling and yuna
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lee. it is inappropriate without a foundation in the law. let me be very specific. when president bush lifted the designation of terrorism -- in fact, nothing -- nothing that the senator from kansas has laid out here actually is supported either by the intelligence or by the facts. and i could go through his amendment with specificity. let me give an example. on march 17th -- this is one of the findings. on march 17th, american journalists were seized by the china border by agents. he's citing that as a mash nape for -- citing that as a rational for putting them back on the list. the families have acknowledged that they, in fact, were arrested for illegally crossing the border. so that's inappropriate. not only is it inappropriate to
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cite a fact that is not fact, but it is not a cause for putting somebody on the terrorism list. nowhere do any of the actions cited here fit into the statutes that apply to whether or not somebody is designated as appropriately being on the terrorist list. let me be more specific about that. when president bush took them off the list, here's what they said. this is the president's certification. the current intelligence assessment satisfies the second statutory requirement for rescission. following the review of all available information, we see no credible evidence at this time of ongoing support by the dprk for international terrorism and we assess that the current intelligence assessment, including the most recent assessment published in 2008 provides certification for the president by congress that north korea has not provided any support for international terrorism during the preceding six-month period. there is no intelligence showing to the contrary as we come to
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the floor here today and it is inappropriate for the senate simply to step in and assert to the contrary. moreover the president said our review of intelligence community assessments indicates that there is no credible or sustained reporting at this time that supports allegations including as cited in recent reports by the congressional research service that the dprk has provided direct or willing support for hez bowl acor the -- hezbollah or the iranian revolutionary guard. should we retain support for dpkr in the future, the president could designate dprk as a ste sponsor of terrorism. well, we haven't, mr. president. it simply doesn't fit under the requirements. we need to use the right tools here. this amendment is flawed and -- i am convinced could actually undermine what i know is going on right now in terms of efforts by a number of different parties
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to try to move this process forward. this is not the way a responsible united states senate ought to go about trying to deal with an issue of this kind of diplomatic consequence. the relisting, incidentally, has no practical effect in terms of anything that it would do with respect to our current policy other than, you know, raise the issue with respect to the senate at this moment, but, as i say, inappropriately with respect to the statutes that are concerned. president bush actually preserved all of the existing financial sanctions on north korea at the time that he lifted the terror designation and he kept them all in place by using other provisions of law. the fact is that -- that this administration has, in fact, responded in order to put real costs on north korea for its
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actions. we led the international effort at the united security council and we did enact sweeping new sanctions on north korea. by all accounts they are biting. the u.n. security council resolution 1874 passed unanimously imposed the first ever comprehensive international arms embargo on north korea. those sanctions are now beginning to take effect, mr. president. and the north korean ship suspected of carrying arms to burma turned around after it was denied bunkering services in singapore and the government of burma warned that the ship would be inspected on arrival to ensure that it confirmed the u.n. arms embargo. that has happened. significantly china has imposed sanctions on north korean companies and individuals involved in nuclear and ballistic missile proliferation much the sanctions recently imposed by the obama administration in concert with the international community are
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having a real impact. so i think we ought to give them time to work, mr. president. i don't think we ought to come in here and change the dynamics that, as i say, i know are currently being worked on by the secretary of state as we are here in the senate today those meetings are taking place. it's better for the united states and the international community to focus our efforts on concrete steps rather than resort to a toothless and symbolic gesture. this will have no impact, ultimately, because we're still going to go down our course, but it can ripple the process which the administration has chosen to pursue. i might also point out, mr. president, the president and secretary of state have been closely communicating with allies and with partners in the region. they are currently involved in discussions with china, russia, south korea and japan on this issue. and even as we debate the issue here, the effort at the osian
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forum is specifically geared to form our approach with the treaty allies an others. we ought to give the administration an opportunity to succeed. third, mr. president, obviously all of us reject the recent actions taken by north korea. there is no doubt about that. but it wasn't so long ago that we were actually making some progress on the denuclearization effort and observers of the region are those who are expert and who follow it closely, are all in agreement as to the rationale for which -- which has driven north korea to take some of the actions that it has. i was in china about a month and a half ago. i spent some time with chinese leaders on this issue because one of the missile -- one of the tests took place while i was there. and i saw the chinese reaction up close and personal. i saw the degree to which they were truly upset by it,
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disturbed by it and took actions to deal with it. and the fact is that they explained it as have others as a reaction by north korea to perhaps three things, one, the succession issues in north korea itself. number two, to the policies of the south korean government over the course of the last year or so. and, number three, the fact that while they had nuclear weapons and had been engaged in a denuclearization with the united states, most of the focus appear to have shifted to iran and there was some sense that the focus should have remained, really, where those nuclear weapons currently exist. we need to preserve diplomatic flexibility in the weeks and months ahead. there's an appropriate time for the administration to come to us. there's an appropriate way for us to deal with this issue, to sit down with the administration, to make it clear to them we think we ought to do this, to talk with them about it, to engage in what the
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rationale might be under the law. none of the reasons that are legitimate under the law for, in fact, designated country as going on a terrorist list are appropriate or fit here. and i think that's the most critical reason of all. i yield the floor. the presiding officer: the senior senator from delaware. mr. carper: mr. president, thank you very much. i thank the floor manager on the majority side for unanimous consent request allowing me to proceed now under morning business. i want to say a word or two about the defense authorization bill which is before us and then i want to pivot and talk about the health of our nation's defenses but about the health care of our people. we start off by extending my thanks to our leaders of the defense committee, the armed services committee, senator levin and senator mccain and
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their staffs and the good work they have done and i thank senator reed of rhode island for his contributions and where i am stand on the floor i am looking at senator reed a graduate of military academy at west point and across the aisle, senator mccain, a graduate of the naval academy. great to have that kind of experience here in the u.s. senate. sitting on opposite sides of the aisle coming from schools sometimes to the to be rivals but working together when we need for them to. i want to express my thanks to the president and to our secretary of defense, bob gates. we've learned in the last seven years we've seen cost overruns for major weapon systems go from $45 billion in 2001 to last year almost $300 billion. it's a growth over seven years, cost overruns from 2001, $45 billion and last year, almost
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$300 billion. what we need is for the administration, secretaries of defense, we need the president, as well, the joint chiefs, to say to us, to the folks under the armed services committee but also to us in the senate and the house, these are the weapon systems we need sex thes; thesee threats we face. give us a sense of priorities or weapon systems we should support and fund, the trip levels we need, and, frankly, the weapon systems we don't need and trip levels we do not need. i was privileged to follow on the heels of presiding officer, senator kaufman, about a month and a half ago, to go to afghanistan and to pakistan and he and senator reed, i think, led that codel, shared with us that our needs in that part of the world, we need a military
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strategy and a civilian strategy in afghanistan and i think this administration has given us a good do-pronge two-pronged apprd said our job is counterinsurgency. we need more troops and more trainers to train our military and civilian side and mobility in terms of additional helicopters, about 150 additional helicopters to move our men and women all over the southern part and easton part of afghanistan to meet the taliban threat. the kinds of weapons that we don't use there or don't need there, i will be blunt, is the f-22 which we discussed and debated here for the last several days, a fighter aircraft been around for a dozen or so years and we are still building more of them but they have never flown a flight in iraq and they have never flown a mission in afghanistan, either.
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they, the f-22 is limited in what it can do. it's a fighter, air-to-air combat. the afghans, they don't have fight are aircraft in iraq, the folks were fighting, they don't have aircraft. meanwhile, we have f-15's and we are going to build them for less than half the price of f-22 which can do dog fight and air support which the f-22 can do for less money and the administration said as hard as it is to stop the production line on an aircraft, in this case, the f-22, in terms of what is cost effective we need to refocus on the f-35 and on counterinsurgency and preparing for the, those kind of challenges we face. we have had a vote 15-40, and i was very pleased and i commend everyone who voted as they did, and, frankly, the people who
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took the opposite view. there were tough issues particularly for folks who states have aircraft produced and systems are being produced. that's difficult to accept. but i'm encouraged by that vote and my hope is we will pay heed to some of the priorities except to us by the secretary of defense to make sure we are spending money on weapon systems we are likely to need in the 21st accepttory century. and today's votes are better online to do that. and pivoting if i can, let me talk about the health of the people in our country. i've, some of my colleagues he are getting tired of me saying this but i talk about four things. the we spend more money for health care than any other nation on earth; two, we don't get better rules; three, we have
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14,000 a day losing health care; number four, 47 million americans today don't have health insurance, don't have health care. we have to do better than this. we have to do better than this. i believe we can. there's been a focus as there should be on extending health care coverage to 47 million folks who don't have it and we need to address that, obviously. having said that, the other concern we need to dress is reigning in the growth of health care costs. we are getting clobbered as a nation in terms of competing with the rest of the world are we pay so much more money for health care and other nations and employers pay and we are getting clobbered at the government legal, the federal government with the cost of medicare and medicaid or state gawsms trying to bear their -- governments trying to bear their cost. they see enormous pressures on their state budgets.
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over lunch today i said to my colleagues in our caul caulk meg that it would be great to have our cake and eat it to and i said that with a piece of chocolate cake staring me in the face but as it turned out there are delivery systems, if you will, of health care, in this country where they are not necessarily having their cake and eating it too, but they are able to provide better health care, better outcomes, at a lower price. think about that: better health care, better outcomes, better quality of health care, at a lower price. and the names are becoming, becoming familiar. some are already familiar -- mayo in minnesota. now they have an operation down in florida, too. see if that model would work in florida and it has. kaiser in northern california. an outfit called inner mountain
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health. cleveland clinic, cleveland, ohio. and a company in he in pennsylva and cooperative called puget sound emulating this result, better quality outcomes, better health care, lower prices. what we need to do as we attempt to extend health care coverage to those who do not have it, 47 million, is reign in the growth of health care costs, the idea that health care costs grow at 2% to 3% to 4% over the consumer price index will cripple us economically and competitively and cripple our ability to reign in the large and growing deficits. sit here on the -- said here open the floor earlier, in the last years of the nation we ran up as much new debt in eight
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year as we did in the first 208 years of our nation's history. think of that, running up in eight years, running up as much new debt in the first 208 years as amation and this year we are on track to have the biggest single year deficit and we are in the worst economic downturn since the great depression and trying to stimulate the economy to get it moving and it is starting to move but that's a human deficit on the heels of, frankly, eight years where we spent like drunking sailors. and i know how drunking sailors spend and it is not a pretty shoe ight and this is frankly, not a pretty shying, either. we need to go to school on the mayos, the cleveland clinics, the kaisers, the inner mountain health, and see what we can learn with them. what is their secret?
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better outcomes, less price. they do a number of things in common. among the things they do, they have literally brought on to their staffs, doctors at cloostlecleveland clinic are on, and the same is true for mayo and other nonprofits. i saw an interesting special on cnn a couple of weekends ago and they were interviewing those at cleveland clinic, a doctor, who used to be in private practice on his own and he said when, in the old days on my own in private practice or group practice, i got paid, really, compensated for the number of hearts i operated on. if somebody came to me and they had a heart problem and it could be addressed by diet or exercise or medicine, usually i didn't prescribe those things because i didn't get paid for that. if they needed a heart operation we could address their problem with an operation, i got paid for that.
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and as a result, i was more inclined to operate on people's hearts than to use approaches that arguably were more cost effective. now he said i work for the cleveland clinic as a staff dock, i don't havdoc,i don't hae compensated. i can provide good advice, help with diet, exercise and weight problems and help people understand their opportunities with medicine, and i still get paid. bingo. the light went off for me and some of us hearing quite a bit about the need to get away from this fee-for-service deal where wwe incentivize doctors and nurses to order more procedures, lab tests, imaging and x-rays because they get paid for it and if they do more of everything they reduce the lookly hood they will be sued.
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and that gets us in this problem where we overuse health care and if we are going to have real success in drawing down the costs of had heck part o of heat is getting away from the overutilization of the health care that we have. let me mention some of the things they're doing at the five or six entities i mentioned, the nonprofits. among the things they did, they coordinate care. i use my mom as an example. my mom is deceased and she live indianaed iedin florida the lasf her life with dementia and arthritis and she had five doctors -- five doctors. the last years of her life she was down there my sister and i would visit my mom every other month or so, take turns, and we would go with our mom to visit
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her doctors and these five doctors my mom had never talked to each other. i don't think they knew the other doctors existed. and they prescribed something like 15 different kinds of prescription medicines. we kept them in her home in what looked like my dad's old fishing tackle box medicine to take before breakfast, after breakfast, before lunch, after lunch, throughout the day. but some of the medicines my i monthly -- she didn't need to take all those medicines. the doctors, if they knew everything my mom -- somebody needed to know what she was taking and could say, you shouldn't be taking these two medicines in combination, they hurt you. and we didn't really have anyone coordinating the care for my mother. one of the things the nonprofits do is coordinate the care that's provided to my mom or anybody's mom or dad. another thing that would have been very helpful for my mom or other people in that situation is to have had electronic health
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records. and if my mom had electronic health records like the v.a. and like we develop in delaware and other states my mom went from doctor's office to doctor's office they would know who else she was seeing and the medicines being described, the lab tests and everything. they would have it right there for her when she came for her regular visit. we have a great ability to harness information a and technology for the delivery of health care, electronic health care records are a big part of that. and our nonprofits i talked about today, the half dozen or so, have that in common. wellness and prevention. we know from not just the nonprofits but an out of the from california, safe way, the people that have markets all over america, and they have several hundred thousand employees and their health care costs from 2004 to 2008 level -- flat. what they have done, they have incentivized employees do do the root thing for themselves, holding down weight, helping get
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off tobacco, fighting obesity, fighting lethargy, just to get off the sofa and eat what's right for them. if they smoke, antismoking campaigns, all kinds of stuff. so we've got a good -- a good model there for to us -- to perform. and it's not just the nonprofits but a lot of the employers that are starting to into this as well. another one or two points that i'll mention on the nonprofits, chronic disease management, heart disease, diabetes, these kinds of chronic diseases. i'm told that about 80% of chronic diseases -- of the costs of chronic diseases can be controlled by four factors: diet, exercise, weight -- overweight, obesity -- and smoking. those four factors control about 08% of the costs of our spend -- 80% of the costs of our expenditures on chronic care, chronic diseases. and if we would work with those four items, it would help reduce the costs of chronic -- will provide better outcomes for these people with chronic diseases but will hold down our
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costs. those are just a couple lessons from the nonprofits. there are others as well, and part of it is pharmacy. making sure that pharmaceuticals, making sure people who need to make medicines, pharmaceutical medicines, large monthly sculle, small monthly scullesmall molecg those. focusing on primary care. those coming out of medical school these days, they want to be specialists. we need more primary care docs. we need to change the ideas of what we need. more primary care docs and less special carol. the other idea is for to us pool insurance costs. as my colleagues know, we have a federal employee health benefit plan. we have really like an insurance pool, where we pool all the federal employees in this country, our dependents, all the federal retirees, their dependents, into one large pool to purchase health insurance. and they purchase health
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insurance and they get it at a not cheap price but a pretty good price. and one of the reasons why when you're buying for 8 million people in a purchasing pool, you get a good variety of choices. and, frankly, we get much better costs. if you think about the costs o of -- of -- administrative costs for health insurance as a percentage of premiums, i'm told in the federal employee health benefit program, it's 10%. when did t come to small -- when it comes to small businesses buying employees, their cost of premiums is 30%. the idea is creating large purchasing pools is an idea that makes a whole lot of sense. i -- i will close there. i -- i -- the idea that we would pass health care legislation and own -- and stop just extending coverage to people who don't have it, that's all we do, we
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have failed the american people. we have to do two -- at least two things. and one of those is extend coverage. but also make sure that the coverage that we extend, we provide better coverage, better quality outcomes, better health care and we do so at a price that is diminished, not -- not continues to expand by several times the rate of inflation. we can do that. we could do that going forward, and that's what we need to do. and, mr. -- mr. president, my friends here have been very generous in allowing notice proceed as i have. i see that several of them are anxious to get back into this debate not on health care but i suspect on other matters. and i yield back the floor. thank you. the presiding officer: the senator from arizona. mr. mccain: mr. president, i rise in support of the amendment offered by the senator from kansas during north korea -- concerning north korea. and i must say, i was entertained by the outlook as far as north korea's behavior is
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concerned by the distinguished chairman of the foreign relations committee. i can't imagine -- i can't remember when i disagreed more. the state department's 2008 country reports on terrorism stated -- quote -- "as part of the six-party talks process, the u.s. reaffirmed its intent to fulfill its commitment regarding the removal of the designatio designation -- designation of the dprk as a state sponsor of terrorism in parallel with the dprk's actions on denuclearization and in accordance with criteria set forth by law." we certainly haven't taken any action on denuclearization and it certainly hasn't been in accordance with criteria set forth by law. there was a problem with the trade. we delisted north korea and we got something worse than nothi nothing. thin response to our action -- i mean, facts are subborn things.
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in response to our action, pyongyang has embarked on a pattern of astonishing belligerence and has reversed even the previous steps that it had taken towards denuclearization prior to its removal from the terrorism list. now, just a few facts. december 2008, just two months after the united states removed pyongyang from the list, north korea balked at inspections of its nuclear facilities, ceased disablement activities at the yongbyon reactor. in march, in march, the government seized two american journalists near the china-north korean border and subsequently sentenced them to 12 years of hard labor in the north korean gulag. mr. president, these are two american citizens that may have strayed over a border. does that mean they are sentenced to 12 years of hard labor in the most harsh prison camps in the world?
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and what are we going to do about it? i mean, it's -- it's remarkable. it's remarkable. two weeks later, it tested a long-range ballistic missile in violation of u.n. security council resolutions. then announced it was expelling international inspectors from young bang, reestablishing the facilities and ending disarmament talks. in may, pyongyang conducted its second nuclear test. in june, a north korean ship suspected of carrying elicit cargo departed north korea, in likely defiance of u.n. security council obligations. and earlier this mong, pyongya pyongyang -- month, pyongyang again larged and medium-range missiles into the sea of japan, including the 4th of july. now, awful these are indications that the north -- now, all of these are indications somehow that the
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nortnorth koreans should not be listed as terrorists? frankly, i respect and reesh united states my friend from kansas, maybe we ought to have a binding regulars luges rather than a sense -- binding resolution rather than a sense of the senate. it's remarkable. pyongyang has never accounted for or even acknowledged its role in assisting the construction of a nuclear reactor in syria, which the his rails had to bomb -- which the israelis had to bomb and similarly has refused to provide a complete and correct declaration of its nuclear programs. and, of course, something we all know, mr. president, which is one of the great tragedies in the history of the world and that is the gulag that -- of some 200,000 people where people are regularly beaten, starved, executed. according to the "washington post," most work 12- to 15-hour days until they die of malnutrition-related illnesses.
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usually around the age of 50. they're allowed just one set of clothes. they live and die in rags without soap, socks, underclothes or sanitary napkins. that -- it's a horrible story. you know, it's not an action that th --accident that theer oe south korean is several inches shorter -- taller than the average north korean. i mean, this regime may be the most repressive and oppressive and orwellian regime in all the world today. and so the chinese have been serious, according to senator kerry, the senator from mass marks the chinese have been resolute. and on the issue of the ships inspections, the u.n. security council resolution calls for monitoring and following of the
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ship and if the decision is made that they need to board a north korean ship, if nort north kores refuse, then they -- the following ship cannot board but can follow them into a port where the port thrort port authe expected to board and inspect the vessel -- where the port authored are expected to board and inspect the vessel. and then that violation is reported to the union security council. that ought to arouse some pretty quick action. and suppose that that ship -- i do not share the confidence of the senator from massachusetts if a north korean goes into a port at myanmar that will you see likely action except maybe the offloading of whatever materials that are being bought by mean march. myanmar.
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so, look, the north koreans have clearly been engaged in selling whatever they can to anybody who will buy it, because they need the money, whether it be drugs or currency or nuclear technology or missiles. and every time we have held on to the football like lucy, they've pulled it away. so i think that this is a very modest proposal of -- of the senator from kansas. i would point out years and years and years of six-party talks, different party talks, negotiations, conversations, individuals who have been assigned as chief negotiators who then end up somehow negotiating i with in the end being further negotiations has failed. has failed. and the north koreans continue to test weapons, to test missiles. and sooner or later, they will match up a missile with a weapon
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that will threaten the united states of america. and so right now, those missiles they are testing go over japanese territory. so i think it's pretty obvious that we are dealing with a regime of incredible and unbelievable cruelty and oppression of their own people. the newly published korean bar association details the daily lives of 200,000 political prisoners estimated to be in the camps. they're eating a diet of mostly corn and salt, they lose their teeth, their gums turn black, their bones weakened. and as they age, they hunch over at the waist. this -- this is -- this is a regime that in every -- any interpretation of the word is an
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outrageous insult to the -- to the world and everything that america stands for and believes in, and i believe they pose a direct threat over time to the security not only of asia but -- but the world. they were able to export technology all the way to syria, obviously. why shouldn't they be able to export that to other parts of the world? so i urge my colleagues to vote in support of the amendment by the senator from kansas, and i hope that we could vote on that sooner rather than later. mr. president, i yield the floor. mr. demint: mr. president? the presiding officer: the senator from kansas. mr. demint: mr. president, i ask unanimous consent to add senator bennett from utah as a cosponse other the amendment. the presiding officer: without objection. mr. demint: mr. president, i thank my colleague from arizona for his comments, and he, more than anybody in this body, understands the situation i think and what also happens in a gulag-type situation. that's what's really drawn me to the topic of north korea now
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over a couple of years has been the human rights abuses of hundreds of thousands of north koreans fleeing simply to be able to get food and then a couple hundred thousand of them in a gulag system that is unbelievable to me that we're in 2009 and we have google theater can even show us the gulag system -- earth that can even show us the gulag system and we're just kind of well, okay, i guess that's just the sort of thing that happens there. it's just mind bog throing me we wouldn't -- mind-boggling to me we wouldn't act resolutely. i appreciate the chairman of the senate foreign relations committee, the senator from massachusetts, is a very distinguished senator, very bright and very experienced in foreign policy. i just really couldn't disagree with him more about north korea. and we've had an ongoing dialogue and discussion about this. he made some points here on the floor about we shouldn't pop this on this bill. i've been trying for months for us to relist them as a terrorist country. i didn't think they should have been delisted in the first place. i thought it was really a
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terrible process move on the bush administration to try to move the talks toward, we're going to de -- forward, we're going to delist you and then you're going to do something for us. but pyongyang, kim jong-il said thank you very much for delisting us, and now we're going to stick it in your face. which is what they've to understand do. and i lested things, which is what the senator from arizona listed as well. the thought that the fact that we're acting resolutely is an insult to the people in north korea who have lived urpdz this repressive regime. we're not acting resolutely towards north korea. we're not putting any sanctions on them. we have a asked for international sanctions. why aren't we willing to put sanctions on ourselves if we think this is such a proper course to follow and we're willing to push it on an international body, why wouldn't we be willing to list them as a terrorist nation, as a state sponsor of terrorism? i don't understand that. i didn't think so if it's good
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in the international arena, we wouldn't do it ourselves. plus we need to have some teeth into this. this is a modest, modest proposal, a resolution, a sense of the senate that north korea should be relisted as a state sponsor of terrorism. we're not listing them. we're saying that we as a body, given the provocative, a since they have been delisted, merits their being listed as a state superior of terrorism. that's what we're saying. without a foundation of law, it is clearly, as i read previously, allowed for the secretary of state to determine that the government of that country has repeatedly supported -- provide support for acts of international terrorism. that's the actual wording of the lawyer in the arms export control act. clearly, they have acted to sponsor international terrorism, with their relations with bur marks with the missiles, with
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the nuclear weapons, with the proliferation that they've done and continue to do. he says and suggests relisting has no practical effect. i believe it does have a practical effect, and it certainly does on the administration's stance towards north korea and their international posture towards north korea. plus it has a practical effect on what we can provide for as far as aid from the united states to north korea. we shouldn't be providing aid to the north koreans. we should provide food aid, if we can monitor it. we shouldn't be giving oil to the north koreans. that should be limited that the administration cannot do that. and they won't be able to if they are a listed as state sponsor of terrorism. mr. president, it will hurt the people of north korea and that are in the north korean gulags if we don't relist them. it removes any i vestige of hope that they might have that at
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some point in time somebody of enough stature like the united states government is going to take enough notice that they're going to put pressure on the north korean regime. i've talked with some people that were refuseniks in the soviet union during a time when we had far less communication capacity than we do today. yet they were able to get messages at that point in time into the soviet gulag that the americans were putting pressure on human rights in the soviet union and the lack of human rights in the soviet union and it gave them hope. it gave them hope. it gave them hope in the soviet gulag. if we can pass this, it can give people in the gulag in north korea hope that somebody is at least paying enough attention to put pressure on this, that maybe they may be able to live free or live at all. it can give them hope instead of abandoning all hope, all ye who enter here, it is it says in the
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inferno and as it is in the gulag system in north korea. this is a modest resolution smed i would hope my colleagues would vote overwhelmingly to relist north korea as a state sponsor of terrorism. i yield the floor. mr. lieberman: mr. president? the presiding officer: the senator from connecticut. mr. lieberman: i would ask that the pending amendment be set aside and that amendment number 1528 be called up. the presiding officer: without objection, so ordered. mr. lieberman: i thank the chair. the presiding officer: the clerk will report the amendment. the clerk: the senator from connecticut, mr. lieberman, for himself and oh, proposes amendment numbered 1528. strike section -- mr. lieberman: i ask unanimous consent that further reading of the amendment be dispensed with. the presiding officer: without objection. mr. lieberman: i thank the chair. mr. president, i'm pleased and proud to introduce this amendment with a bipartisan group of cosponsors. to state it briefly, it extends
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the authorized end strength of the united states army by 30,000 over the next three years, effective with the commencement of the fiscal year 2010, and it does this -- doesn't mandate this increase, but it expends the authority of the secretary of defense, obviously with the support and authorization of the president of the united states, the commander in chief, to extend the end strength of the u.s. army. end strength means how many soldiers can the u.s. army have. and of course it does this to reduce the tremendous strength -- excuse me, the tremendous stress on the u.s. army, which is carrying the burden of combat in two wars -- in iraq and
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afghanistan -- today. and over the next year or 18 months, we'll be in this unique position. as progress has been made, thank god, in iraq and the iraqi security forces are progressively taking over responsibility for keeping security in their country, the drawdown of american soldiers is happening in a methodical and responsible way. and i again express my appreciation to president obama that that's the way it's happening. at the same time, we are increasing our troop presence in afghanistan. bottom line: the demand for members of the u.s. army on the battlefield over the next year, 18 months, at the outside two years, is going up. if the supply remains constant, that means that the stress on
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every soldier in the u.s. army and his or her family will not be reduced. as a matter oit may in fact go . there's a term for this, which i'll get to in a moment, which is dwell time. this is an amendment that began with members of the senate armed services committee, a comparable amendment in the house armed services committee, recognizing as we all do the tremendous stress that our army is under, the extraordinary job they are doing in iraq and afghanistan. this is really the next great generation of the american military. but we see it in some tough statistics. the increase in mental health problems, the increase in divorces of members of the service. and, worst, of course, the increase in suicides. there are many things that we have supported here in this
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senate and in congress and the administration has to respond to each one of those problems, but in a way, the most direct thing we can do is to increase the size of the u.s. army so there's less pressure on every soldier in the army in this sense: every time we add another soldier to the u.s. army -- and we're talking here about authorization to add 30,000 more -- it means that much more time every other member of the u.s. army can spend back at base retraining, preparing, and, most important of all, spending time with their families. now, as i know the president knows -- that the president of the senate -- i know the president of the united states knows it, too -- the good news is today that secretary of
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defense bob gates, who's really done and is doing an extraordinary job for our country -- which, of course, the support and authorization of president obama -- yesterday announced that he would be temporarily increasing the active duty end strength of the u.s. army by 22,000 soldiers over the course of the next three years. i cannot sufficiently express my words of appreciation for secretary gates' decision. he he acted by -- he acted by employing emergency authority he has in a combat declaration of war -- or, authorization of the use of force and a built-in statutory way where he has up to 2% of existing -- 3% of existing end strength to expand the size of the army. this amendment, which had been
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planned and was in the committee before this great action by secretary gates yesterday, is now before us, and i'm honored to offer this amendment with a bipartisan group of cosponsors that are listed on this amendment as a way to do two things. the first is that it literally increases from 547,000 to 577,000-plus the authorized end strength of the u.s. army to leave that authority there in case there is a need that secretary gates and the president see in the coming three years to raise. -- to raise the number -- mr. mccain: will the gentleman yield for a question? mr. lieberman: i would be happy to yield. mr. mccain: it is my understanding that this amendment authorizes the additional forces that secretary gates has said yesterday in a speech that we needed -- or, day
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before yesterday. why do we need to put this into the bill? mr. lieberman: two reasons. the first is that it gives -- it's a bit beyond what secretary gates did. he authorized using extraordinary powers he possesses as secretary in this time of conflict, up to 22,000 for the next three years. the amendment authorizes -- doesn't mandate, doesn't appropriate for it -- 30,000 for the next three years. so it gives some latitude, depending on how conditions go in iraq and afghanistan t, to ga bit further, 8,000 more over the next three years. second, when this amendment starts, we didn't know that secretary gates was going to do this. i'm grateful he d but this amendment now frankly, as secretary gates himself said to me yesterday -- and i appreciate it and i don't think he would mind if i said it here on the floor -- gives the congress and the senate the opportunity to essentially vindicate and
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support the step that the secretary has made and, as he put it, send a message from the senate to the members of the u.s. army, help son the way. -- help is on the way. mr. mccain: there's no doubt that the army very badly needs the help now and in the foreseeable future. mr. lieberman: my friend from arizona is absolutely right. there is no doubt, based on the demand -- certainly temporarily -- over the next 18 months, perhaps two years, as we're drawing down from iraq but not as rapidly as we're adding forces in afghanistan, that there is at least a temporary need for more than the authorized 547,000 members of the u.s. army. mr. mccain: and, if i could question the gentleman further, perhaps this will eliminate any requirement for stop-loss or for involuntary extensions in a
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combat area? mr. lieberman: absolutely. as a matter of fact, one of the sentences -- one of the reasons secretary gates gave yesterday, i am a geeing to read, "the decision to eliminate the routine use of stop-loss authority in the army requires a larger personnel flow for each deploying unit to compensate for those whose contract expires during the period of deployment." so, yes, this makes it possible to end the use of stop-loss, which was essentially blam essee people to stay actively dough ployed longer than they originally were going to be deployed. mr. mccain: i thank the senator. mr. lieberman: i thank my friend from arizona. we've illuminated most of the reasons in our exchange why this is important. i will add a few things that secretary gates said yesterday, which is that the army has reached a point of diminishing returns in their multiyear program to reduce the size of its training and support tail,
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so to speak, the training and support to support the active duty army. the cumulative effect of these phak fers is that the army faces a period where its ability to continue to deploy combat units at acceptable fill rates is at serious risk. and here's the point i just made in response to senator mccain's question: based on current deployment estimates, this is a temporary challenge, a temporary point of stress. we hope and pray that's true. it certainly looks like it is, which will peak in the coming year and in the words of secretary gates, "abate over the course of the next three years." end of quote. mr. president, in addition to the secretary of defense, we've heard from the army's chief of staff, general george casey, secretary of the army pete geren, who have been advocates within the pentagon for this
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increase in end strength. and i thank them for that. admiral mullen, chairman of the joint chiefs, told our armed services committee earlier this year that the light at the end of the tunnel, as he put it, is still more than two years away, and that is only if everything goes according to plan, which in combat it obviously often does not. again i say this is an authorization. it's not a mandate. i will add that secretary gates announced yesterday that he will find a way to fund the additional troops in this year and fiscal year 2010 when it begins october 1, by reprogramming other funds appropriated to the pentagon but for fiscal year 2011, which is the budget that will be presented to us next year. it is probable that the
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department of defense will require funding as part of its normal operations and more likely as part of the o.c.o. to overseas contingency operation fund kh-rbgs supports our presence in iraq and afghanistan. mr. president, i can't say enough. i know all of us in the senate feel we can't say enough in gratitude to the members of the u.s. army who are leading the battle for us against the islamists, extremists and terrorists who attacked us on 9/11/2001. we owe them a debt we can never fully repay. one thing we can do, which secretary gates did yesterday and the senate can do in this amendment, is to send a message to our troops in the field that help is on the way in the most consequential way, which is in additional members of the u.s. army. i would ask, mr. president, that when the vote be taken, it be
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taken by the yeas and nays. the presiding officer: is there a sufficient second? there appears to be. the yeas and nays are ordered. mr. lieberman: again, i say to my colleagues, i'm doing that, although i expect there will be very strong support for this, because i think it's the most visible way for this senate to send that message to the u.s. army of appreciation and gratitude and to them and their families that help is on the way. i thank the chair and yield the floor. a senator: mr. president? the presiding officer: the senator from michigan. mr. levin: mr. president, let me commend senator lieberman and others who support this amendment. we on the armed services committee are very supportive of the previous increases. indeed, we led the way on some of them because of the stress on the army and the number of commitments which have been made in iraq and afghanistan, we must give the kind of support to our
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troops that they deserve and the american people want us to give. one of the ways we can reduce some of the stress is by increasing the end strength so that the dwell time is more sufficient and there's other positive spinoffs as well from this kind of increase in the authorized end strength. the secretary made a very powerful speech the other day when he called for an increase of 22,000, i believe, in the end strength. that end strength is temporary. it's almost as large as this, not quite. this is 30,000. but this is surely in the ballpark. it's appropriate. it is authority. it is not mandatory. and i think it is a very positive signal to send to our men and women in uniform and to their families. so i support, very much support the amendment. mr. lieberman: mr. president? the presiding officer: the senator from connecticut. mr. lieberman: very briefly, i want to thank senator levin, our
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chairman on the armed services committee, not just for his strong statement of support now, but for the support he's given throughout our committee's deliberations to the goal of achieving an increase in army end strength. i thank the chair and yield the floor. the presiding officer: the clerk will call the roll. quorum call:
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mr. cardin: mr. president? the presiding officer: the senator from maryland. mr. cardin: i ask unanimous consent that the quorum call be dispensed with. the presiding officer: without objection. mr. cardin: mr. president, i'm going to talk about an amendment that we have not yet cleared for unanimous consent. i'm hopeful that that will come. but in order to advance the issue, i intend to talk about my amendment 1475 without offering it at this time. and i think it is an appropriate amendment to talk about at this point following senator lieberman's amendment, because senator lieberman's amendment deals with increasing our force. and one of the reasons that it's important to do that is the stress that it -- that the
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restricted numbers provide on our military personnel. and senator lieberman mentioned, and i will repeat, the number of suicides and attempted suicides by our young men and women serving the united states military has increased. and one of the reasons, quite frankly, is the repeated deployments, the length of deployments shr added to the stress of our -- have add to the stress of our servicemen. health experts agree that there is most likely a combination of factors leading to the increased number of suicides. many of these factors are simply the result of prolonged conflict our nation finds itself in, including multiple deployments, extended separation from family and loved ones, and the over preplg stress of combat experiences. each placing a unique and tremendous strain on the men and women in our all-volunteer force. so we've recognized that in the past, and we've increased the number of our military in order to try to reduce the frequency
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of deployments. for those who have to witness the ugliness and devastation of war firsthand, they have encountered something very unnatural for the human mind to comprehend or accept. for these service members, recovering from these experiences involve a long and arrested whitehouse journey in learning -- and arduous journey. this learning process is accomplished with the guidance of highly trained mental and behavioral health specialists. in light of this, congress appropriated significant increases in mental health services to our military families. we've increased the number of providers and access to our troops and their families of mental health services. that's good. that's very positive and it's had a very positive effect. but we now must focus on the fact that there's potential harm being practiced or administered by antidepressants to a
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population that tpraoebgtly moves throughout the theater of -- that frequently moves throughout the theater of war. one of the concerns that i have is that we've been prescribing antidepressants to our military personnel. they had the challenges of warfare, and we're not certain they're getting the follow-up care that they need with the use of these depressants. there was a 2007 report by the army fifth mental health advisor team, indicated there could be as high as 12% of our combat troops in iraq and 17% of our combat troops in afghanistan are taking prescription antidepressants or sleeping pills to help them cope with this stress. this equates to roughly 20,000 troops on such medication in the theatre right now. what i find particularly troubling when reviewing these figures is the pentagon has yet to establish an official clearinghouse that tracks this
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data. the army's best reported estimate can only tell us that the authorized or prescription drug use by troops in iraq or afghanistan is believed to be evenly split between antidepressants and prescription sleeping pills. what my amendment would do is try to provide us with the information so that we know what is happening on the use of prescription drugs. providing that this is the best estimate contains some degree of accuracy, it is important for us to also recognize that many of these same antidepressants are strongly urged by f.d.a. with a warning label that young adults age 18 to 24 years of age may be at an elevated risk of suicidal thoughts or behavior while using this medication. in other words, the age group that is vulnerable to an adverse reaction for potential suicide is 18 to 24. and 41% of our military force
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serving on the front lines in afghanistan and iraq fall within that age group. while keeping this warning label in mind is imperative that my colleagues understand that nearly 40% of army suicide victims in 2006 and 2007 are believed to have taken some type of antidepressant drugs. an overwhelming number are using ssri's. the number of army suicides each month are outpacing each preceding month. the class of antidepressants, the ssri's, unlike most earlier classes of psychiatric medications in that they work from their inception specifically designed to be used as antidepressants. that is they were engineered to target a particular process in the brain that plays a significant role in depression or other anxiety disorders. more significantly however, these ssri's are unlike most other antidepressant medications because they are still allowed by department of defense policy to be prescribed to service
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members while they are deployed or directly engaged in overseas activities. now there is widespread consensus in the community of professional mental health providers and empirical evidence to support that ssri's do offer significant benefits for the treatment of posttraumatic stresses and some forms of depression. and although there are some side effects, they are reportedly much milder and short in duration than other antidepressants. ssri's are also believed to potentially prevent, or at least some believe lessen the harmful impact of posttraufplt stress disorder -- post traumatic stress disorder. my concern is the long term effects of ssri's, but more importantly the volume and manner these drugs are being administers to men and women overseas need to be further analyzed. unlike medications that work as an as-need basis, ssri's only
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begin to work after having been taken every day at a specific dosage for a specific period of time. this frequency translates to a three- to six-weeks lay ten is i period before the -- latency period before the patient feels to feel improvement. there are two very readily apparent problem with the shortcoming. first is that the service member serving in a forward operating area such as afghanistan or iraq are quite frequently subject to moving between bases or into other areas. some so remote that there may not be a trained medical health provider to help administer the treatment pattern to make sure it's effective. second and more importantly, in this initial period is when patients, particularly younger patients, often suffer an escalation and severity of depression and anxiety. they may be out on an outpost
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when this occurs. d.o.d. may be prescribing ssri's to a service member without the assurance that they will remain in a capacity to observe by haoeupl trained mental health provider. these same patients may very likely find themselves off last night's twins-a's game elded with a controversial play at the plate. the twins' michael cuddyer was called out while trying to score from second on a wild pitch. it looks like he snuck in from this angle. manager ron gardenhire agreed after the game, definitely cutty was safe. no doubt about it. we got to thinking instant replay could have overturned this call if the umps were allowed to use it. we asked sports nation, what should mlb do with instant replay, junk it, leave it or expand it. >> expand it. what's the down side? don't tell me this will slow the game. in the seventh inning, people sing. oh, the replay, got it really
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right. baseball's always struggled with technology and advancing and evolving. they're way late on replay. the nfl has been using it for years. even now they slowly introduced it only for home runs. plays at the plate count as run, too. bring it in, embrace technology. evolve baseball. a little bit of instant replay. they're getting there, but slowly. >> bud selig not a fan of instant replay. it is a big deal for him to allow it in the little way he has. please, time wasted? managers yelling at umpires, that's time wasted. >> we asked "sports nation," what should baseball do with instant replay, junk it, leave it, expand it. you voted? >> expand it. >> i say expand it. sports nation voted leave it, 46%. but 90% want inassistant replay. they just haven't figured out how they want it. >> it will take one big
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controversy in the world series and everyone will want to expand it. >> we're here monday through friday on espn2, say something nice. >> what if our show had instant replay or flags or penalties? >> no. >> get working on that. >> pedro martinez's road back to the majors continues. the phillies' newly acquired pitcher completed a simulated game today. he threw four innings, 64 pitch, faced batters for the first time in 11 days. he'll throw off the bullpen on thursday. if all goes well, he'll enter a simulated game or minor league game on sunday. >> i feel good basically, real, real good. for the first two innings, a little sluggish a little bit. i probably need a couple more days to settle down. as for as the physical condition, fine. >> pedro's last year with the mets left plenty to be desired.
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the 5.61 e.r.a. whip above 1.5 and his five wins left him without a team after the season ended, so the wbc became somewhat of a showcase for him. though he only threw six innings for the d., he allowed just one hit and no runs. >> update you on the angels and the royals. and the angels scored three runs in the second inning alone. a 3-0 lead. they were up by as many as 4-1678 the royals coming back thanks to jose guillen with a two r.b.i. single. that cut it to 4-3678 condition dri morales extended his hit streak to 19 games with a single in the third. still to come on espnews, manny ramirez hit his 537th home run passing mickey mantle. our "aircheck" crew debates. at 155 miles per hour, andy roddick has the fastest serve in the history of professional tennis. so i've come to this court to challenge his speed.
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...on the internet. i'll be using the 3g at&t laptopconnect card. he won't. so i can book travel plans faster, check my account balances faster. all on the go. i'm bill kurtis and i'm faster than andy roddick. (announcer) "switch to the nations fastest 3g network" "and get the at&t laptopconnect card for free". round of miller lite. (announcer on call) ...here it comes... watch this now... got it! my goodness! now you have seen it all. (announcer) that's what greatness tastes like. triple hops brewed. great pilsner taste. miller lite. taste greatness.
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>> this is jeff norman. he doesn't get health insurance from an employer, so he's been buying it himself for years. he's healthy, so he wonders why his rates keep going up. liz sloan wants health insurance but doesn't think she can afford it. we're assurant health, and we've been customizing plans to meet the needs of individuals for over 110 years. for instance, with our two-year rate guarantee and healthy discount, jeff will get 15% off his rate and lock in that rate for two years. for liz, we offer plans that allow people like her to pay for only the benefits they need, saving them money. in fact, liz could get up to $2 million of coverage for less than $100 per month.
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unlike other health insurance companies that focus on corporations and treat everyone the same, assurant health is there for the individual. so if you need health insurance, call the number on your screen, visit our website or contact >> back here on espnews, he's one of the most hyped pitch centers recent memory. the washington nationals took him first overall in the draft. according to pedro gomez, negotiations not going well between stephen strasburg and the national, indicating the nats might not get this deal done by the august 17th midnight deadline. the nationals' interim g.m. mike rizzo said this about strasburg: and for more on the story we
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bring in espn's pedro gomez, who is with us now. what's the latest on the negotiations? >> really nothing has happened since the draft. all the players that are picked have to be tendered a minor league contract within ten days of the draft. the nationals certainly did that. but we're talking about a standard minor league deal that calls for every player to just receive $1,000 a month. there's no talk about bonus. that was to close a loophole from a few years ago when they discovered that contracts had to be tendered within ten days some the nationals have done that. they have until mid-nigh on august 17th. there has absolutely been no offer made yet, and, you know, the window is closing. we're talking about the last three, three and a half weeks before that window shuts, and this is the number-one overall pick. everybody knows that the nationals didn't sign their number one overall pick last year, aaron crow, a right-handed pitcher out of missouri.
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you're looking at two straight years they don't sign their number-one pick. >> pedro, how much is scott boras affecting this deal from getting it done. the way you're making it out to sound, it's more like the nationals? >> it's probably both, but you have to have an offer in order to at least say yes or no to an offer. and at this point major league baseball's central office, the commissioner's office has pretty much dictated that they want clubs to try to sign their players through a slotting system. now, this is not a hard and fast slot system similar to the nba. it's more of a suggestive slot system. teams are allowed to go outside, but they have to go and ask permission so to speak from the commissioner's office in order to do this. that has not happened. there has been no offer made, and like i said, we're talking about the draft that took place five, six weeks ago. there's about four weeks left until the absolute drop dead deadline. strasburg had a few options that he could do, that could come his
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way if he doesn't sign. but right now the way it's looking, it looks like he may have to follow up on those options. >> pedro, what's he looking for? is there any indication from scott boras or the nationals saying strasburg is asking for too much? >> there has been no financial indication of what he's looking for, not at least publicly. there's been speculation that we're looking at somebody that's going to want say $30 to $40, maybe even $50 million as a signing bonus, and one thing that scott boras is on the record as saying is that you look at international players, you look at jose contreras when he signed with the new york yankees. he got a guaranteed four-year deal for $32 million. that was eight, nine years ago. you look at daisuke matsuzaka with the red sox a couple years ago. he got a guaranteed $50 million deal. that didn't even include the $48 million or so that the red sox had to pay in what is called a
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posting fee. that was just in order to negotiate with matsuzaka. so you're looking at about $100 million the red sox paid to sign matsuzaka. so he has been on the record saying why are the international players worth so much and yet the american players who are subject to the draft not worth the same? and if you kind of read between the lines, mike, you'd think that maybe $30 million to $50 million, somewhere in there is probably the bonus they're looking at. the nationals have used the fact that mark prior has received the single highest bonus and that was about $10.5 million back in 2001. you know, baseball's revenue system back in 2001, they brought in about $2 billion. now they're bringing in close to $7 billion. so if you extrapolate, you'd say that strasburg should be maybe in the $30 or $40 million range. >> pedro, real quick here, for strasse strats, what's the worst-case scenario, this deal does not get done in washington. for everybody involved here, what's the next step for stephen? >> you're looking at probably a
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similar scenario that luke went through when the dodgers failed to sign him after the 2005 draft. he went. he worked out on his own. he got stronger. he finally signed with an independent league team. he pitched about 22 innings, struck out 34 batters that year. went back in the draft the following season in 2006 and was selected number one overall by the kansas city royals. the dodgers, who had picked him at 40th overall the year before offered him just under $3 million. the royals ended up signing him for a $7 million bonus. so i think you'd probably see strasburg do something similar where he went, worked out on his own all winter and reenters the draft. interestingly, the nationals, who look like they will have the number-one overall pick next year because the worst team gets it, would not be allowed to draft strasburg again. you are not allowed to draft the player who you did not sign the year before. the nationals would receive a compensatory pick for not
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signing the number one overall pick, and oddly enough, that would be the second overall pick in next year's draft. so you could be looking at the nationals having first and second pick in next year's draft but not being able to collect strasburg with either of those picks. >> he's also considered the best pitching prospect in recent memory. unbelievable. pedro gomez on espn. pedro, always appreciate the time. >> absolutely, mike. take care. >> michael vick is out of federal custody. now he has the burden of proof to roger goodell. what does that mean? top stories ahead. there's something big happening at pizza hut.
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 last night the new yorks began the first of the three game series against the washington nationals, they got the best of jim riggleman's ball club winning it 6-2 and the nats look to win the 27th game of the season and hand the mets the 48th loss. john lannan get it is call to try to stop the national's slide. it's all coming up here on masn.   every night is a good night for baseball. great to have you with us tonight for game two of the series against the mets. brought to you by our good friends at verizon wireless.
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6-2 last night and ray, a lot of things to make up for tonight and number one to get the first win for jim riggleman the local guy as the interrum manager. >> yeah, it's just about pitching, hitting catching and throwing and we haven't been able to do that consistently. we started off great offensively and had a tough time with the bullpen and made a lot of changes to that and then our offense just kind of tanked and our starting pitching got better and bet ir and the defense hasn't been real good. our situational hitting hasn't been good but jim riggleman is one of the those fundamentally sound managers in the game and a great lineage coming up from the dodger's organization and similar to the st. louis cardinals, the reds, pirates and he'll get the thing turned around if anybody can. >> we talked about the losses and sometimes losses are magnified or minimized by the
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los of the players. they scot word that scott olsen will not pitch this year and undergoing surgery on thursday and finished for the year. that's a big loss for a guy battling all season long. >> yeah, it is. i felt something was wrong with him early and throwing 88 miles an hour and you don't lose velocity unless there's something wrong and he didn't have the velocity coming out of spring training and throw 93, 94 and dominate and i read a quote one time that every time he takes the mound he has a chance to throw a no hitter and that wasn't the pitcher we saw here. we saw two good outings after rehab and the second time i didn't know what it was going to be but i felt like it was trouble. >> we hope, we're keeping our fingers crossed it will be a successful surgery and back with us gwen next year and he knew something was wrong and we wish him the best. tonight the business at hand, go out and get the win and knock
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off new york. >> yeah, and we can do that. basing oliver perez, he's struggled this year having a lot of physical problems and the new york team is not the team that started the season. they've got a lot of guys on the disabled resistance and made trades, francoeur was acquired because they have not had any pop and haven't hit home runs and the least amount of home runs as any team in the last 12 years. >> you need the stick in the line up. >> i'd get you a base hit. >> one bright spot for the ball club last night was the tiching of tyler clippard. he was lights out and perfect three innings. >> just an example of what scouting does and putting a guy in a position to allow him to succeed. tyler has a good fastball and a dog gone yakking curveball and a change up that hesitates at home plate. when he gets ahead of you, he
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goes upstairs with a fastball and that's a sign of a guy that knows how to pitch. he changes the eye level up with the fastball and threw last night had five strikeouts in 3 innings and gave up nothing and over the last five outings he's given up no runs, no hits, 7 strikeouts and for the season he's got a 2.13 avj. you'll find gems. >> the numbers will make jim riggleman and steve mccathy happy and he strikes out five of the nine batters he faces and 28 pitches. >> you have to have somebody coming in that misses bats and he misses bats. he can strike somebody out. you get bases loaded situation and got a one run lead, he's a guy to bring in because you know he can punch people out. >> back in the clubhouse last night tie lir clippard talked about his performance coming out of the bull pen for the pats.
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>> i was to roy indicate the off speed stuff and it was a successful night for me. >> is this the best you've felt all season? >> i've been feeling good all season, you know. obviously one of my better outings but more of the same. i've been feeling good. >> tyler clippard feeling good and getting the job done. there's been a major change when we look at the bullpen going back to tril compared to today -- april compared to today. >> how about 15 different people out there, johnny. the thing that you have to be impressed with, the first seven, 7.73 run average. that's three runs, that's not anything to sneeze at and we've got much younger and still have
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the three left handers out there and beimel has been consistent and kensing has a short arm motion with a good fastball and macdougal the best stuff in the bullpen and bergmann a power guy. >> this should be it from here on in. this is a solid bullpen. >> i don't know what they're thinking but it's the best bullpen we've had match up wise and mix wise, too. you've got guys that throw firm and a little different angle and sinkers and the change ups out there and all your left handers are different and feature something different. i think not only the best arms that we have available, i think it's the best mix and a lot of tough guys out there. >> time for the hold of the day brought to you by just for men hair color. let's talk about clippard and burnett as nationals what
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they've done. one loss record and clippard has no wins and burnett with a 2.66 e.r.a. and clippard 2.13 and just as they stay in the game with the nationals, you too can stay in the game with just for men hair color. we'll take a break and come back and take a look at the starting line ups and comments from austin kearns and he'll be along also on nats xtra pregame when we continue after this. ?
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 there's one of the finer eating establishments here at national's park as soon as our show is over, ray and i are heading over to have food and working on the in field getting ready for the first pitch coming up in a couple minutes. let's take a look at the new york mets starting line up. david wright, 0-4 last night, a couple of strikeouts but ninth in the national league and a batting average of .318, 21 stolen bases and his fifth in the senior circuit and since may 1, hitting .330 and leads
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the national league with a .420 batting average against the left-handed. pagan in center and castillo and david wright at third and jeff francoeur in right field and tatis and murphy at first and santos will catch and alex cora the shortstop and perez on the mound trying to get another win for the new york mets. brian zimmerman did not play and no injury, nothing to read into it except the fact they're playing 25 games in 25 days and here's the rest of the line up. nyjer morgan in center and christian guzman in the number two hole and ryan in the third and dunn and willingham and austin kearns gets the call in right and alberto gonzalez will be at second base, wil nieves
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will be catching and john lannan on the mound. welcome back everybody, johnny holliday and ray knight. another perfect night for baseball and more perfect if the nats can come through and knock off the mets. were you surprised zimmerman got a night off? >> no, i wasn't. when you look at some of the stats he's only hitting .230 since the last 57 games and an astonishing number i came across, 98 strikeouts in 57 game when he only had 26 strikeouts when he hit .364 and not made any contact and on hit .179 in july and he has to be tired mentally and sometimes a day off will do wonderful things for you. >> ryan had thoughts about sitting out last night and didn't pinch hit and wasn't going to be playing at all and here's his thoughts in the clubhouse. >> for the guys that play every day, having a day every couple
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months not so much the physical, that helps you physically but more mentally to show up and relax and watch the game instead of being part of it. >> you had two scenarios, a player situation and a manager situation. as a player, did you want to have a day off and as a manager, did you want to give a day off? >> as a player, i never wanted a day off because i thought that day was the day i'd come out of it. 75% of what you have is better than 100% of the next guys. those were down the stretch when you're tired in august and september. a player doesn't want to come out but there are times as i got older in my career, i knew i needed a day off and wasn't going to go in and ask for one and afraid somebody would take my place. as a manager, you can see it. you can see his bat gets slower and starts to foul balls off and
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zim has fouled a lot of balls and not getting to the fastball at times. it's a grind and he's a grinder and it's good for him to have a day off. >> austin kearns went 1 for 3 and had a walk in the loss to the mets and debbie taylor is with austin right now. >> reporter: austin, your second consecutive start tonight. how would you describe the way your season has gone? >> obviously not how i would have liked it to, but that's kind of how it's been for us as a team, too. i don't think any of us expected this to have a season going like this. it's been frustrating but you got to keep working and come to the park and play hard. >> reporter: how have you managed to deal with the role you're not used to? >> just try to prepare. that's the only way i know and i haven't really done this before
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and i just try to stay prepared throughout the game and stay loose and do something to get a suite going and be ready if i get in there. >> reporter: you had good bats this week and talk a little bit of work with rick and how you've been able to approve your approach at the plate. >> it's just trying to have good at bats and sometimes it's tough when you're not getting regular ab's and trying to go up there and give a good at bat and keep working on the side with rick and sitings in on bullpens to get timing from when i'm out there. that's about it. >> reporter: what do you have to do to be effective against perez? >> i think you have to just get a good pitch to hit because he can be erratic and don't help him out any as far as chasing pitches. he's a guy that can walk some guys and the pitch count can get
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up and wait for one you can handle. >> reporter: austin kearns, thank you very much. let's go back to johnny and ray. >> thanks very much. what's really confusing about the whole situation with austin kearns looking back with the reds, .315 in '02 and four years ago with this ball club, he had 18 home runs and you can't lose it that quickly, can you? >> what he's lost is the confidence and his feeling he can do the job up here. you do get lost mentally and i had it happen in houston and all of a sudden i had a little rib cage tear and i tried to play through it and when i got healthy my timing was off and i actually broke out in bunts because of the stress and i never had that and i was a 32-year-old player and 2 for 27 and didn't feel too good about that either. eventually if you get to play enough and i fortunately got to stay in the line up and he came out of the line up and it's much
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tougher to come back. >> much, much calmer today, aren't you? >> yes. >> i wouldn't want to see that, believe me. austin has been struggling and maybe he'll break out of that. we'll continue more and still more baseball all week long and the mets are here for one more game tomorrow night and the cardinals on thursday beginning at 7 and san diego for friday, saturday and sunday all on masn 2 and the nats xtra pregame show beginning 30 minutes before. phil wood coming onto join us after this. pa announcer: final boarding call... all passengers... each with an average speed of 590 mph... almost as fast as you. nothing's gonna hold you down.
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grab your bag . it's on™west so our low fares stay low. ( ding ) book now at southwest.com. geico's been saving people money and who doesn't want value for their dollar? been true since the day i made my first dollar. where is that dollar? i got it out to show you... uhh... was it rather old and wrinkly? yeah, you saw it? umm fancy a crisp? geico. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance.
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  >> the nats get set to battle the new york mets, game two of a three game set. ronnie holliday along with ray knight and phil wood, how are you doing well? >> i'm doing very well. i'm going to ask you to come up
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with three random numbers in the 50s for me. >> u, 53, 58 and 54. >> now tell me who's going to win the -- you're right on the money, johnny. now there's no way to dress up the 2009 season that the nationals are having to make it look better. obviously they're on the way to likely another 100 loss season. the thing about baseball, there are multiple examples of teams having similar problems that have basically recovered. that's where the numbers that johnny just mentioned come in. 1962, the mets lost 120 games and over the first six seasons they averaged 63 wins. yet in the 8th season they were world champions. how'd they do it? mostly with starting pitching. tom sooefr came along in '67 and
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kuzman and ryan and they acquired don -- they were world champions in the 8th season. number 58, the toronto blue jays and the first four season they averaged 58 victories and the following season, the strike shortened season they finished with a record of 37-69, yet by 1989, '84 they were winning 89 games and in '85 they won 95 games. how'd they do it, with starting pitching.   i mean, they did it with their pitching staff. move ahead now to the detroit tigers and 2001 to 2003, pretty bad club averaged 54 wins a season those three seasons.
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the following two seasons they were still under .500 but in 2006 they were american league champions and how'd they do it? starting pitching, exactly right. they brought up robertson and i guess in '02 i guess and brought up justin ver la dner and starting pitching is where it's at. these are post expansion examples. the nationals have put together some pretty high feeling pitching prospects and some of them are will on the big club and obviously it's a struggle right now but a bumpy ride. >> that was my next line, patience will pay off in the end. >> it comes down to starting pitcher. >> of course what they're doing, they want everybody to be
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patient. losing streaks aren't fun but there's always the next day and could get it rolling tonight. >> baseball will be in dc for a long time. >> thank you, phil. always a pleasure. we'll talk about the starting pitchers when we come back. john lannan and oliver perez. we'll continue with more in a minute. is perfectly cold? or do you risk drinking a warm one? if you have the new coors light cold-activated can, you're covered. because now every can turns blue when your beer... is as cold as the rockies. it's cold insurance, only from coors light. cold beer: that's our policy. ( smack, crowd awes ) you might want to put something cold on that. frost-brewed coors light. the world's most refreshing beer.
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 >> national's park here in washington, d.c., game two of the three game series. welcome back everybody, johnny holliday along with ray knight.
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they've lost six straight and jim riggleman locking for his first win. one guy that's happy about the ace taking the mound tonight, that's willie harris and feels confident john lannan can help stop this slide. >> we're all excited for john lannan whenever he pitches and not only him, all of the pitchers. i think john lannan is more experienced as far as experience goes but we're out there working hard behind all of them no matter who they are and looking forward to lannan going out and keeping us in the ball game and hopefully we can get big hits. >> he's done that almost all yearlong. >> two years, johnny. over the last two years, john lannan is in the top 20 in quality starts and every time he goes out he gives them an opportunity to win. 8 of the last 9 have been quality starts and he's gotten the earned run average to 3.64 and the thing that follows him
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from last year is the offense isn't scoring runs for him and barely three run as game for john lannan and 6-7. if they would have scored 4 rubs a game for john and last 7 innings, his record would be 9-3. that just shows you how well he's pitched. >> he has to be feeling good about the game tonight because he beat the mets 7-1. >> he matches up real good against the mets and these guys are fastball hit herbs and like it up and out over the plate and keeps it down and away and throws the hard breaking ball that buries at your shoe top and he's a tough match up and he negates the power by going down and away and it helps him out a lot. >> for the new york mets, oliver perez is getting the start, trying to continue their winning ways. nats beat him up and knocked him out of the box.
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>> he's been hurt all yearlong. he was out for two months with a problem with his back and threw terribly. he won 25 games last year, his earned run avj has been around 4 his entire career. this year he has an 8 earned run average, 7.99 and walked more hitters than strikeouts, 27. >> that's good. >> that's good for us. he has tremendous stuff. he's a guy that should win 15 games everywhere. 93 miles an hour fastball and very energetic and athletic and has a hammer for a breaking ball and doesn't throw a lot of change ups and most of the pitches are hard. he's having a tough year. sgh so it's perez against john lannan and the nationals try toing get things going and jim riggleman having sleepless nights trying to get the first win, a lifelong dream to be managing in a city. for ray knight, i'm johnny
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holliday. bob and rob coming up in a moment. ♪
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 . >> bob: last night a classic case of youth versus experience and j.d. martin made his major league debut and took his lumps while veteran hernandez was cool, calm and collected keeping the nats off balance in route to the win. tonight, oliver perez and john lannan match up, game two from national's park. 
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 it's a gorgeous night at the ballpark and breeze is blowing and it's game two of the mets and nationals needing a win against the east, the needing a win at home and basically needing a win. time to get a w and maybe john lannan gets them there and rob dibble, last time he pitched a complete game, one unearned run, four hits. >> rob: i believe that was the start of something special for him. he's had a great season on a tough club to have a great season and the emergence of the ace of the staff and i think it came back with the complete game against the mets and the first one of his major league career and got a lot of help from the defense and got out with the double play ball. that's something a veteran pitcher would do even though he's 24 years old and has the most starts by far and he goes out there and right there and tied for first in the major leagues with the 20th start of
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the season and hopefully it will be more owning a new york team and own it had yankees and the mets. >> bob: that left hander doesn't make $36 million but this one does and the mets beat up on oliver perez in april 26th and the nats won that 8-1 in new york and 7 runs, 9 hits and we live in a city of history and maybe it repeats itself tonight. call... all passengers... each with an average speed of 590 mph... almost as fast as you. nothing's gonna hold you down. grab your bag . it's on™west so our low fares stay low. ( ding ) book now at southwest.com.
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  >> bob: nationals baseball on masn brought to you by southwest airlines, book your next trip at southwest.com and by wendy's. it's way better than fast food, it's wendy's. fans coming in, mets, nats and the new yorkers own the season series so far, 8-2 and won 3 out of 4 here and the line up with a battered new york
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mets, they hit nothing but line drives here last night and david wright in a funning since the break and only 3 for 16 but he has 33 multihit games. he's the league's fifth best on baseman. he has been the one constant and healthy constant they've had in the line up. john lannan takes on the mets and 2-3 and stepping in, angel pagan to face lannan who starts for the 56th time in his career. rob will set the scouting report for you in a moment after we call strike one. ball game understood way right on time, 7:05, partly cloudy skies, sunny at the moment, 82 degrees and a breeze blowing out towards left field. pagan had a good game last night. 
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 he's not jose reyes but not many are. the mets have the second highest batting average .266 with houston and the dodgers lead with .274. and a line drive just like they did last night and pagan base hit out to austin kearns in right field. >> the scouting report, bob, our man lannan, he's money, 3-1 at nat's park this year, 2 e.r.a. and about four more, i would like to have four more with john lannan and i think i could win a world checkup and once he's gone at least 5 innings, 18 of his 19 starts and only one time has he not gone 5 innings this year in a start. >> bob: that is money. here's luis castillo and a good
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bunt man and sacrifice man and at this point a double play man. >> rob: good 4-6-3 man. >> bob: he was trying to hit behind the runner. >> rob: i think he did it five times against him in a complete game and four regular double plays and one from right field, i think dukes threw somebody out. trying to hit behind the runner and hit it to the second baseman. >> bob: there was a 9-6-3 double play. >> rob: you're amazed by my memory, aren't you? >> bob: i'm astounded. >> rob: don't ask me what i had for breakfast. >> bob: so it's david wright with the bases empty and two outs. doug innings is a local home plate umpire and david
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wright batting at .318 and getting very little protection at the line up and jeff francoeur has hit .345 in 7 games and they have the man they call frenchy batting behind david wright and the nationals threw too many balls over the plate to francoeur last evening. this guy has had a really good start to his career and nationals defensively, willing happ back in left because dunn is at first and kearns gets another start after getting the average off the interstate last night and austin had a base hit and a walk last evening and guzman and gonzalez solid and zimmerman, dunn and wil nieves. that ball hit high in the air, left field. under it josh willingham who's played most of his career in that position and the double
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play ball brings the top of the 1st to a good end for john lannan. ♪ ♪ tell me who's watching. (announcer) it's right here. it's easy. ♪ i always feel like somebody's watching me. ♪ it's the money you could be saving with geico. and i am the chief shoe giver at toms shoes. i operate my entire business from my phone. i need a network with great coverage, because for every pair of shoes that we sell, we give a pair away to a child in need. it would be impossible for me to do this without a network that works around the world. (announcer) more bars in more places.
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at&t. the best coverage worldwide.  >> bob: nationals coming uph a batting average of .261. you might find it interesting, that's the same battling average the philadelphia phillies have but the nats are ninth in runs and home runs and ryan zimmerman has hit well against perez and ryan is so much better against right handers this year and
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that's a little oddity. one of the few left handers he handles well and third behind morgan and guzman. we've been looking forward to see -- his career record is 57-62. >> rob: as we mentioned last night, the free agent signing to the tune of $36 million could turn out to be one of the great boondoggles in free agent signing history. >> bob: morgan tries to bunt and he is out on a good play by perez and got over to the line and wheel and had fired a strike to murphy. >> rob: first i have to say wow, nice play by perez. make him throw strikes. he's very erratic and started off on the disabled list and 7 walks in the 5 innings and 2 by
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7, that's how many wins they have and 32-33 that's how many walks he has in innings pitched this season. >> bob: one of the few times morgan has bunted and not had a base hit. guzman pops up first pitch and shortstop, alex cora, two outs. cora is across from castillo up the middle and david wright and daniel murphy and omir santos behind the plate. sheffield is still nursing a hamstring that cramped up on him over the weekend. here's ryan zimmerman with the .316 career batting mark against oliver perez.   comes out, throws a strike. well, let's see how ryan
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zimmerman is after a night off and nick johnson's turn tonight.   and there's another hit for zimmerman. some hitters, some pitchers and the match up doesn't go the piper's way. >> rob: it looks like he's doing something in the delivery and wind up to throw strikes and 11 walk this is 11 innings pitched and coming off the disabled list which is not an injury disabling, more mental and bad mechanics and stay on the ball and trying to throw a fastball over the middle about 87 miles an hour and easy pickings if he tries to find the plate like that all night. >> bob: here's adam dunn with a fastball over the corner. adam dunn 7 walk this is his last 7 games and his on base average hitting right on the
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.400 mark putting him in the top 10.    >> rob: even perez when he was on the rehabilitation starts, 11 walks in 17 innings down in the minor leagues and still struggling to throw it over the plate.   >> bob: 0-2 to dunn. short lead by zimmerman and perez goes after it with high
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heat and adam dunn strikes out for the 106th time this year. each team with a base hit and nothing in the 1st. pa announcer: final boarding call... all passengers... each with an average speed of 590 mph... almost as fast as you. nothing's gonna hold you down. grab your bag . it's on™west so our low fares stay low. ( ding ) book now at southwest.com. all around the world, men with erectile dysfunction have asked their doctors about cialis. ask your doctor if a cialis option is right for you because in addition to 36-hour cialis, there's another dosing option: cialis for daily use, a low-dose tablet you take every day so you can be ready anytime the moment is right. man: tell your doctor about your medical condition
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and all medications and ask if you're healthy enough for sexual activity. don't take cialis if you take nitrates for chest pain, as this may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. don't drink alcohol in excess with cialis. side effects may include headache, upset stomach, delayed back ache or muscle ache. to avoid long term injury, seek immediate medical help for an erection lasting more than 4 hours. if you have any sudden decrease or loss in hearing or vision... stop taking cialis and call your doctor right away. announcer: 36-hour cialis or... cialis for daily use. so when the moment is right, you can be ready.  >> bob: right back here at the home of masn and the nats, national's park on this beautiful tuesday night. here's some game notes for you, oliver perez, rob, you know what you've been saying, the higher the e.r.a. the more trouble the nats have against somebody.
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john lannan really good against the mets here at home in his career and overall 2-3 in 7 starts and the mets have hit 4 home runs in 20 days of july and jeff francoeur the most recent to go deep last night and only hit 53 home runs and the fewest in all of major league baseball.   francoeur had a big night last night and a double, a single, a homer and two rbi's and raised the batting average from .280 to .345 but christian guzman gets him there and john lannan has three out of four ground ball outs already and 11-year veteran has the plate.   the mets start the night four games under .500 but nine back of the red hot
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phillies hosting the cubs again tonight. well hit right field and kearns turns and back pedals, he's got it and austin never got concerned about that one and fernando tatis retired quickly. >> rob: oh, just a long out.    >> bob: in philadelphia tonight, rich harden for the cubs who pitched so well here and joe   blanton, no score early and here's daniel murphy. blant   murphy hitting .242 and had him ine three hole last night and went 2 for 4 with two rbi's. john lannan 11 pitches, nine
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strikes in the first inning and oliver perez comes out and throws 8 pitches, all strikes. >> rob: didn't help the fact that the first two hitters that faced him swung at the first pitch. one was a bunt and one was a pop up to short. way to make them work. >> bob: you talked about the control problems he had in the last start. >> rob: the last start against the braves, first start off the dl, 7 walks. what's the approach tonight? let's swing early in the count before he throws us a bunch of balls? >> bob: 28 strikeouts, 32 walks this year coming in. you can't be that aggressive early in the count against a guy who can't throw strikes. 1-2. john lannan buried the breaking ball and the count is even. >> rob: there's two reason to help oliver perez get through
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the wildness. swinging early in the count is going to help him.    >> bob: next up is omir santos the catcher. he did a real nice job for them while brian schneider was hurt. fastball up, 3-2. >> rob: so good they got rid of castro. >> bob: they let him go and it was apparent when schneider came back who would be the other catcher. and he serves one to left field and that's a nice swing on a 3-2 pitch away and a base hit for daniel murphy, who's now 3 for 5 in the series. that's what these mets do. they hit line drives and get on base. >> rob: there's christian guzman giving an effort.
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  >> bob: omir santos is 28 yeas of age from puerto rico and that's it for that bat and the mets in the top of the 2nd. lannan gets another ground ball out and number 16 josh willingham and he needs to get hits and it's been a tough start after the break for josh who's been swinging well for the most part this year. we've gotta pay for. and a few things we want to pay for. on top of it all, we're still trying to put away some money for the future. with the wish list, we can save up for anything we want. and still have enough to cover the day-t0-day. plus, the savings engine helps our money grow. and that's something we need and want. introducing the virtual wallet from pnc, a high definition, online view of your money. pnc. leading the way.
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 >> bob: they've got the redn by the red loft and red porch tonight. it's the bottom of the 2nd in a scoreless ball game get your red on. five plans, so pick your plan, your games, your seats and get a free one.   john lannan off to a good start and let's sf the nats make oliver perez work a little and here's josh willingham who is for the most part a patient hitter. josh had the night off last night and since the break he's 0-13, two walks and hit by two pitches.   nationals at home are 16-31 and the mets on the
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road not much better, 19-28 after their win last night. the boys would love to get one for jim riggleman and there's jerry manuel whose ball club is beat up nine games out of first in fourth place.   willingham, kearns and gonzalez here ine 2nd. that's a breaking ball that misses, 3-0. >> rob: 3-1. >> bob: 3-1, pardon me. >> rob: that's okay. that's what i'm here for.    >> bob: and he missed. there's the at bat we've been waiting for with patience and debbie taylor, austin kearns has had to exercise some of that this year.
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>> reporter: absolutely. he's hitting .345 with 4 home runs and 8 runs batted in and what do you have to do to be effective against the lefty? >> i just think you need to make sure you get a good pitch to hit. he kind of relies on you to help him out with the breaking ball and getting to chase fastballs up and if we be patient and wait him out. >> reporter: perez is known for being either very good or all over the place and the nats plan to make him work tonight, bob. >> bob: that's a perfect follow up to what rob was talking about in the bottom of the 1st when morgan and guzman did just the opposite. so it's 2-0 now and he walks hilling happ and now he's behind kearns and gonzalez is next and see what he does on 2-0 here. this will be interesting. you throw austin kearns a
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fastball, he can hurt you and he was taking, 2-1.   he's been on base in 35 of the 39 games he's started and austin has two hits in the last five at bats. for him, that's something to build on the way this year has gone. and his hand comes off the bat and we frequently see that where his top hand will come off and look at that blast in new york.    >> rob: i'll say he's comfortable against perez, i'd be lying. he's more than comfortable. >> bob: the nats behind jordan zimmermann getting the second career win beat the mets 8-1 to salvage one of a three game series. that was the nat's fourth win of
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the year. almost at the end of april. 2-2 breaking ball and he's gone. well, after the count went to 2-0, not the kind of at bat austin kearns was looking fo >> rob: he did say, you got to watch out and you'll help him with the breaking ball. right here perez gets ahead and back even in the count and throw as 2-2 breakingznnlnún andúé dd up and broke the imaginary plain of the plate. that's going to be a tough thint of playing time andou know he wants to be aggressive and sw the bat.  was hot úú0 for his last 9 g .315. 
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 that's not his game hittihe ball in the air and alex cora for the second out.   that will bring up the number eight hitter, wil nieves and gonzalez in a mini slump just when the nats wanted to see him get a lot oat bats. >>: they're trying to make a judgment on alberto to see if he can be an every day player at this level. he's got 7" more games to e what he can do. i'm sure the roster could change in the next couple of weeks. >> bob: here's wil nieves who's 6 for his last 9 and had the 4 hit game in houston a a couple more against the cubs over the weekend and a breaking ball in there from the left hander.
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  ten days until the trading deadline. a week from friday. and the latest report i just saw online says that toronto's jp says a trade of roy halladay is "unlikely". nieves gone and so are the nats in the bottom of the 2nd, no score after two.
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  >> bob: ryan zimmerman had the day off last night when they lost 6-2 but in sunday's game in a loz to the cubs he put on one of the best clinics at third base all year starting with the tag throw double play. >> rob: he was a busy man and he needed a day off yesterday and made a lot of great plays in the field and taking a lot of heat for some throws he's made and made a few errors but made more great plays and very young and he's an excellent defensive third baseman. >> bob: if he was a hockey player, the plus minus rating would be way up on the plus side. >> rob: absolutely. i'm defensive when it comes to him and i've been around guys with throwing issues and with him, he's a younger guys and sometimes he'll have the mental let downs where he doesn't have great mechanics firing over the first and rear back and throw it
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over there and let your first baseman worry about catching it. >> bob: here's al recollection cora and ryan zimmerman has never come close in three years to loading the national league in errors but there are two third base men that did that and went onto win gold gloves. both of them as young players were brutal with the glove and they knew they could hit but both worked hard on their defense and ryan zimmerman has a leg up on them because he's already so very good with the glove. but it can be done. and i know coaches and manages will tell you, that is the one fasit you can improve the most. cora hitting .245, 22 strikeouts
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and 22 walks and a bouncer and lannan couldn't get it and guzman does and unloads and adam dunn reaches down to pick it and well done on both ends.    >> rob: well the first part about this play is you have to catch the ball. you have a speedy runner, catch the ball, guzman catches it and flicks it and dunn nice pick at the end and here's the xmo view and two hand into the grove and exchange and fire it over there. >> bob: that is a great replay because rob, if he one hands that ball, it comes out of the grove. >> rob: yep. >> bob: that thing had wicked spin and that's too high of a bounce for ryan zimmerman. oliver perez is 4 for 11 this year with that base hit and has a .156 career batting average.
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the nats are seeing some of the best hitting pitchers in baseball. >> rob: well, the thing about a pitcher is you know opposing pitcher is going to try to get ahead with a fastball first pitch and sometimes the best pitch to swing at is the first one in the count because you may get breaking stuff after that. >> bob: first pitch change up to angel pagan. >> rob: pagan went the other way the last time and that's probably the scouting report on him and go away from righties. you try to pull him you'll pull it on the ground with the change up and you saw him go in with a breaking ball. 
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  >> bob: one ball, one strike. fastball in there and he's gone change up, breaking ball, heater and has a 1-2 count and now if you're pagan, what do you guess. >> rob: now you're thoroughly confused and now you get a change up or a back door breaking ball. >> bob: tried to paint with it and just missed. >> rob: that must have gone around the plate and a nice back door breaking ball that could have been called a strike.    >> bob: john lannan just said to wil nieves, how did that look on pitch track on masn? >> rob: i think he said kick the umpire by accident. i'm kidding, i'm kidding. >> bob: wil said the seam of the
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ball caught the outside of the box. 2-2 and a pop up and pull it off the ball and austin kearns right there for an easy second out. that will bring up luis castillo. come on out sunday first 20,000 fans, saturday pardon me, be one of the first 20,000 fans to enter the gates and get a free eco friendly tote bag and the nats padres 7:05, 888-632-nats or online at www.nationals.com and get your tickets and get your red on and join us for the weekend series with the padres. 
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  >> bob: that's a good fastball and castillo could only look at it and the count is 0-2. you'd love to see david wright lead off the 4th if you're a nat's supporter. >> rob: just a bit tardy on the fastball. once again, whenever we play the mets, i marvel at how the mets just try to put the ball in play, bob. they don't try to do too much or overswing. >> bob: that's really all they can do right now. >> rob: they're a good contact team and put the ball in play and put pressure on the defense. castillo is killing them and slaps the ball and runs.
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>> bob: he's a veteran hitter and doesn't bite on the high fastballs. that's the pitch that alberto gonzalez has to lay off. castillo wants the ball down where he can handle it and get over the top of it just like that. on a one hopper to nyjer morgan. two more hits here in the 3rd for the mets and have four in the game and that will bring up david wright.   braves have an early run against the giants at home tonight and atlanta 6 and a half back of the phillies. 
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 oliver perez nowhere near the speed of castillo 90 feet behind him and john lannan has fallen way behind david wright.   dangerous count here. and he jacks it to center hh in the air and morgan back and back and leaps and he's got it. nearly 400 feet away. what a great finish to a long, long run. hey mom i need some minutes.
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  >> bob: there's absolutely no doubt about it if you wear a zimmerman jersey with two number 1's on it, maybe you're tempted to buy one with just one on it. what a deal he made when he brought this man to our ball club. >> rob: his defense has been spectacular and that saves at
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least two runs. well, you saw how fast he got back to the warning track and he knows his own stadium now and timed it perfectly and made a great catch. >> bob: here's john lannan with four base hits and 4 for 32. roger has just started to move around and do a few little trotting drills and pretty sore after doing some of that but i saw him in the clubhouse and told him i can't wait to see you at full speed today playing the outfield next to nyjer morgan. he smiled and said he can't wait himself. he's on the way back. john lannan career 7 for 90 and he takes the fastball for a
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strike and that's k number three for oliver perez and let's watch and see if the next two hitters show any patience at all after the very quick at bats in the 1st inning.   he's hitting great for the nats, almost.340. clutch in the late innings and the only problem is the nats have been behind in so many of the ball games when he gets hits in the late innings, that often stops the running game. >> rob: he's been so impressive but off the field, his attitude, he's an amazing young man and a lot of fun to be around. >> bob: yes, he is. off speed breaking ball, 1-1. >> rob: works as hard as his craft as anybody on the team and definitely a keeper. >> bob: i like the hockey mentality he brings to baseball because he was so good at that
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sport.   >> rob: a lot of discipline in hockey. you got to sharpen your skates and take care of your equipment and put your time in on the ice. it's carried over to his baseball career. >> bob: i did see him sharpening his own spikes downstairs. nobody wanted to have a grove or arm down when ty cobb came in there and that's a one out walk and see if he can turn it into another bag but there is a left-handed pitcher on the mound looking right at him. >> rob: if he gets picked off as we talked about, go right to second base and let's see if murphy can come up with the ball quick enough and throw him out.
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he's got the type of speed if he takes off, i don't know if they can come up with the ball and throw him out. >> bob: that's the 33rd time he's walked this year, 4th as a nat, inching out to the cut of that grass and he's holding. this is fascinating. we've been wondered about this situation. christian guzman is not a patient hitter and he has 8 walk this is year at 321 at bats and this is not your protoe typical number two hitter. away in deed. of all the great base stealers, they've had a guy behind them to take pitches and help them out.   ricky hernandez had carny in oakland. sometimes the guys make it
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tougher on themselves to give their guy an extra pitch or so and that time he got a good look at the move of perez. >> rob: carny was such an amazing hitter and he could hit with two strikes with the best of them and be better than anybody. >> bob: he had more power than the other two i mentioned. 1-1 to christian guzman who popped out to short the first time up.   ryan zimmerman, base hit first time against perez.   guzman right-handed this year hitting
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.321 and they have him picked off and the first baseman throws it aggressively and morgan is gone, 1-3-6.   nyjer morgan is also the league leader in being caught. that's the 13th time he's opinion caught stealing this year. >> rob: that answers that question. a great job by murphy coming into the ball and talked about that with nick johnson who does not run in three steps to catch the ball and has not thrown out a couple of guys. when you pick a guy off, the first baseman has to come there. watch murphy on the play, as soon as he sees him get off, watch him go to the infield. he's on the grass when he catches it and of the bag and nyjer has no chance. >> bob: he's create it had throwing lane before he has the
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ball. >> rob: he's cut off the distance between the pitcher and himself by two feet and that's what you have to do to get a guy like nyjer morgan. >> bob: very well played by young mr. murphy and then he didn't boost that throw to shortstop, either. that was a fastball. good battle here by christian guzman, 1 ball, 2 strikes, bases empty, two outs. and a breaking ball outside.   right at the second baseman, castillo. nats lose a runner at second and one hit in three innings against
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oliver perez and his 8 e.r.a. úú
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  >> bob: some nice treats to be had and a little late dinner for the fans. nothing wrong with having dinner at 7:50 and it's the top of 4th
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inning and here's jeff francoeur against lannan. the lefties are ruling this one and francoeur has his fourth base hit of the series and the mets have at least a hit in every inning. well, they might be the punch and judy mets from a hitting standpoint but doing what they have to do quite well.   johnson, what a good switch hitting power he was. >> rob: you don't have to tell me. he hit one off me. yeah, he had great pop. >> bob: he was a 30-30 guy.    >> rob: he was a very patient hitter, too and he would sit there and make people make a mistake. >> bob: fernando tatis flied to kearns the first time and has a
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right field thing going again this time out of play. jimmy rollins has homered bottom of the 3rd, phillies 1, cubs 0. if he gets hot, nobody will catch the phillies.   their pitching was horrible early and so ws jimmy. lannan on a crazy spinner and gonzalez will hit into a double play. the nats turn their second twin killing of the night. >> rob: francoeur not a fast runner and gonzalez comes across and grabs the ball and lannan does a nice job of not deflecting that ball and it was a jam shot and gonzalez gets it, steps on the bag and done with
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it. another pick, by the way and second ball he's picked out of the dirt. >> bob: i thought derek lee was still in town for a moment. >> rob: that would be crazy. >> bob: here's murphy two outs, bases empty. 7 ground ball outs for john lannan and that ball hit pretty well to left. willingham is kirkeling under it and josh grabs it about 8 feet in front of the wall. every time john lannan gets a double play he tushes it into a quick inning. you really need it these days. how come? well if you're hurt and can't work it pays you cash... yeah to help with everyday bills like gas, the mortgage... ...and groceries. it's like insurance for daily living. so...what's it called? uhhhhh aflaaac!!!! oh yeah! that's it! aflac. we've got you under our wing.
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  >> bob: i thought they were going to make a move from the back and take this thing and teddy not a factor. let's see who wins it by a nose, tom or george. some nice pony tales. right after that he collapsed onto the field. >> rob: unbelievable. thank dpod there was medics down there. >> bob: you want to leave it all on the warning track. >> rob: george is a little old. >> bob: that's right.   ryan zimmerman, still young. and a base hit first time and his 103rd hit of the year and
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single to left.   adam dunn struck out against oliver perez the first time up. ryan might be ready to take this guy out of the yard the way he's been swinging against him. not on that breaking ball and no swing oliver perez 182nd career start and he's 57-62, 4 .5 e.r.a. career and 3-4 in nine starts against the nats.   a fastball on 3-1 and lowest e.r.a.
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in july and the midsummer guy. pretty good company, though. the on lefty on the list.   that's close but zimmerma takes t wal and here he goe rob,ú he'spwld thuys tnght and somebody has to get a big hit. >> rob: well, you have to make him pay when he starts making mistakes and somebody has to come through with a clutch hit and so far tonight the nationals have not and throug >> bob: big nubr 44 t-sit given out tonight and all the big guys are wearing them. the big strong guys. >> rob: strong like bull. >> bob: how about strong like upper deck. >> rob: i would like that. >> bob: called strike. 
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 dunn second in the league in walks and in the strikeout department, third in the league with 106 and ryan howard 107 and martin reynolds of arizona,.125. pulls off the breaking ball and that .125 the most in baseball and carlos pena, day, 119. that leads the american league and now adam has to find some contact here on a 1-2 count. 
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 nationals have hit 82 home runs and the mets have given up 85. they just don't hit them anymore.   there's the dpraet eye on the breaking l over but low, count even 2-2.   there's contact right side and the ball snes through and zimmer pan is going to third because it takes forever to get to francoeur even with his great arm and the nats big boys play a little small ball here and a corner situation with nobody out. hey, you need a little luck now

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